And the comments from yesterday from Legal Immigrant was deleted! Great freedom of speech white @$$
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@1s6 well said. People disliking your comment says exactly what you highlighted, white western supremacism and high rate of racism at SAP.
@1r5 racism at SAP exist, here you have the best example.
@1r5 what a distorted mind you have. The world doesn’t spin around the “west world”, nor “western cultures” are the benchmark of greatness . And people still defending there are not racist at SAP, here you have your answer.
People don't want them well-behaved.
People want them out of here.
Why is this that so difficult to understand?
As a legal immigrant if you don't feel welcome then just leave, no? If Germany isn't your country then what is the point of staying and suffering here?
SAP was hiring immigrants because we wanted help on topics where there was no local labor available. But this was a temporary measure not a permanent one.
People from Western countries who have a similar culture are welcome. Refugees and people in distress are welcome. But economic immigrants are not welcome. We have seen that SAP lays off German employees to keep immigrants are lower salaries and T levels. That is why this is such as big problem. And many immigrants do not contribute to the society. They send money back to wherever they came from. And they bring more family here and the crime rate goes up.
The only solution HR could give so far is to keep all these immigrants under a trusted manager and use performance management to make them leave. But even that isn't easy due to the laws in Germany.
So of course we have to vote accordingly in the next elections. I don't want to be laid off because my job is going to some immigrant. Only AfD vows to solve this problem. The other parties don't even want to talk about it. If you think things are bad for you now, how do you think they will be after AfD is in power?
Truth be told, I appreciate all you did for SAP. But with layoffs around the corner, we have to take care of our own first.
@1f0 where does SAP find so many racists from, or is it just the solitary one of you who is bitter about something
@1dm yes but who is checking whether tokens are used for the correct reasons that actually help SAP? SAP gives as much power to managers as possible so many managers have asked their reports to skyrocket their AI usage so they can be promoted or given very high ratings in performance reviews. This performative use of AI is doing more harm than good but it is being encouraged by top management in every area.
Indians seem to be safe, but how is the situation for Americans and Europeans?
Do we need to worry?
@1bg I don't believe such an approach will work for long. Eventually they will (and should) have some way of determining the value of your token burn. Burning tokens just to burn them is dishonest and almost like stealing. At least try to think of something productive to do with them.
SAP wants to lay off anyone who doesn't use AI. In my team we have a plan to ensure the token usage hits €500 every month when our actual usage would be close to €100 per user. It is a sad state of affairs where they're just waiting to lay off as many employees as possible so the executive board can get as much payout as possible.
Racists can hate immigrants as much as they want.
Companies, including SAP, know that it makes sense to hire Indians, and will continue to do so.
Go go go, Indians!
@12q very true. Hatred against immigrants doesn’t stay hidden anymore, nowadays it’s proudly expressed in the open. We can see the instruments put in place at SAP, so they get fired or leave “voluntarily”. When you mention racism in this forum, you star to collect many -1 votes. Those numbers tell the anti-immigrants and racism sentiment at SAP.
@x8 Many Germans feel that their jobs are safe no matter what. And that is true for a majority of colleagues who don't work but only spend their time politicking. It isn't surprising that they are AfD fanboys and fangirls. The racism in WDF and ROT is much much worse than in the US. All day I hear some complaining that Signavio and recent acquisitions has too many immigrants and that we should take over their management and drive away these immigrants back to their countries.
We can't get these people to think about SAP or the economy or anything that matters. Their hearts are filled with hatred but they are too cozy in their jobs to face any repercussions even if there are layoffs. They're all 'connected'. It's not a surprise that these talks have also found their way in this forum.
The tonal shift in messaging over the last year or two is very telling. McKinsey has instructed SAP to fear monger employees out of the building. If employees leave willingly, then obviously no severance needed. As a double edge to that sword, they have also begun tracking employees in the background in a number of different ways - badge swipes into the buildings, AI token usage, browser usage etc. This is all to build a potential narrative to fire you with cause and again, avoid severance.
These moves are very deliberate and obvious if you know where to look and listen.
@10w Watch the bond yields and interest rates, the AI bubble will pop and big tech is finished when it rises because so much of the hyperscaler CAPEX is increasingly running on borrowed money and big tech won't be able to pay it back. Mass layoffs on a grand scale will happen over the next 3-4 years - it will be biblical. Only thing to invest in is gold, silver, real estate, farms, clean water infrastructure and maybe a plane ticket out of the West if they (CEO+ elites) aspire to achieve this fantastical vision of having everyone replaced with AI including warehouse operators and cleaners. Like Elon said, money will be worthless in 10+ years right?
If the board runs out of toothpaste, you might be safe.
- trust your board -
Layoffs when the stock price is doing so well would be the ultimate immoral act.
I cannot believe the board would go so low.
(And LOL, the number I have to enter is 67…)
being lazy and you will get promoted
@y2 And most of the investments into AI spending are now coming from bonds and loans which are sensitive to interest rate changes. Some of these are kept off balance sheets so that every company that does an AI earnings call can reassure investors that things are going fine. They're not. It's only when companies run out of your money who turn to bonds for sources of finance, and we've been doing this since ChatGPT was released 3 years ago. If AI borrowing ramps up with investor funds drying up to keep up with demand then that's when the AI bubble begins to wobble and pop with rising interest rates. Same thing happened during Dot Com, Biotech and GFC.
I'd scrutinize AI and acquisition loans from SAP very closely, once interest rates go up expect more layoffs and/or the share price to dip. You can see based on our financial reports in 2023 most of our debt was fixed interest and we will be moving onto fully variable interest loans from 2027 and onwards. So I would say that layoffs may get worse if the company needs to pay off this debt if sales revenue isn't good and/or interest rates rise. This also depends on how the investment bankers are pricing in our shares and EPS for their QoQ targets. But the IBs are always selling AI Buy ratings with their price targets not clearly understanding the fundamentals of high-growth stocks.
Only reason why some companies like Microsoft announced they made money from their AI Copilot was because they forced installed that malware on everyone's laptop without their voluntary permission - most of it at the enterprise level. The news that workers around the world are now being KPI'd to use AI usage says a lot about adoption rates. Outside of that, it was totally unheard of that a share price would fall because a company exceeded operating profits and revenue records because of 'sell the rumour, buy the news'. This shows how bloated the AI space has become.
Hopefully, this AI craze will be over and people move on from this fatigue where business leaders have been sold into hemorrhaging money into data centers and AI compute infrastructure. The only people who would use this are almost never retail consumers outside their 9-5 working lives, or those that do would be students looking to cheat in their exams. When the AI hype cycle finishes, that's when people need a good helmet against an mass layoff avalanche.
@x8 https://www.wsj.com/tech/ai/why-big-techs-ai-spending-is-3-trillion-higher-than-it-seems-e1067bb2?st=t6ah2f
@x8 Thank you!
The amount of racism in a layoff forum is astounding, talking about topics that have nothing to do with layoffs. SAP is relying on retiring long-term employees to reduce its headcount and expenses, and keeping the grunts in similar salary tier, same paying jobs (the ones who do the most work). And yeah, it is true that some "Indians" are entering the company but they are being rehired (mostly) in India where labor laws are weaker and are in roles that can be easily replaced by AI (e.g., support roles). Eventually. AI will hit these folks hard.
Throughout the past 3 years there has been ongoing announcements on social media of people announcing their retirements or moving onto their "next opportunity". They are reducing headcounts on a one on one basis. There isn't going to be one big-bang announcement that X department is being reduced. This is designed to make sure you don't have a sense of job security, always in the world of FUD and looking for the next opportunity.
With all of this All in on AI, this means SAP's spend on AI services and infrastructure will balloon, and they are making us train Joule in an attempt to replace us as a part of their mandatory training. This will soon bite the leaders back because AI is becoming more and more expensive to run due to high energy costs, water consumption, pushbacks by society, more memory costs, surprise IaaS lease costs, hidden debt, circular financing, etc. that make it economically impossible. Combined with the unacceptable hallucination and error rates that put customers off from spending thousands on tokens. The server companies will charge high data center leases and stack token costs on top for their profit margins that ultimately make AI a broken solution. Unless we get a model like DeepSeek or Kimi K3 that is 20 times more efficient that obliterates the need for more data centers.
Unfortunately, data center CAPEX costs will remain high throughout 2027 and early 2028. As long as AI compute infrastructure remains stubbornly expensive, layoffs will continue until the market crashes because investors will walk away growing tired and impatient on a positive AI ROI and companies are financing their AI infrastructure with private debt. US Fed Reserve is too corrupt to raise interest rates so Americans will become poorer and poorer.
Essentially, we're all waiting for the AI bubble to pop and then we lose our jobs.
@jf true to this. Silently letting non-Germans quit slowly using power games and racism at work.
@jm In fact if you are an Indian not yet working for SAP it is dead easy to get hired.
Only Americans and Europeans get chucked out.
And this is how it should be.
If you are Indian you are safe.
Layoffs are still going on here and there but are small and under the radar. In Germany, we're currently putting DEI employees like women and immigrants under German managers so we can get rid of them in the future by letting go of such teams. The works council does not pay close attention to re orgs and box moves so this is quite easy to do.
Stock is doing great.
No need for layoffs.
Haven't heard any relevant layoff news in Chinese social media yet.
trust your board
I think external will get cut first
@ag exactly in line with CEO coms style. ^^
Maybe. Maybe not.